Hamid Awaludin was Indonesian minister of law and human rights
from 2004-2007 when Jusuf Kalla was vice president, and was Indonesian
ambassador to Russia and Belarus from 2008-2011.
1.
Anwar
Ibrahim claims it was Jusuf Kalla who approached him whereas Jusuf Kalla said
he was approached by Anwar. Which is true?
Hamid
Awaludin:
I was present during Jusuf Kalla’s discussions with both Anwar
and Najib. It was Jusuf Kalla who accepted Anwar’s request to mediate. He did not
take the initiative and approach Anwar. Jusuf Kalla does not have any political
and economic interests in Malaysia. He is busy with his affairs in Indonesia. So
why would he take the initiative and approach Anwar? It isn’t logical.
Jusuf Kalla considers both Anwar and Najib as good friends. He
wanted to help because they were competing fiercely with one another. That is
how he saw this.
2.
Anwar
claims there were several "preconditions" in the agreement eg. free
elections, fair media, etc. Can you outline any preconditions?
Hamid
Awaludin:
I am very sure that there were no preconditions discussed
between Jusuf Kalla and Anwar. For me, a deal is a deal. And there was a deal
that both parties – Anwar and Najib – agreed to.
Some people always try and find a loophole after the event, or
an excuse not to deliver on their promise. Some people are different in character
to others.
3.
Anwar
now claims PM Najib didn't sign the agreement and it was therefore not valid. Jusuf
Kalla says the PM did give his verbal agreement and therefore the deal was
agreed by both parties, and was valid. Is Anwar correct or is Jusuf Kalla?
Hamid
Awaludin:
Anwar knew that Najib did not sign the agreement. Najib had very
reasonable, political reasons for not signing the agreement and Anwar
understood and accepted it.
But Najib gave his word that he would honour the agreement. He
consented to the agreement. Basic morality teaches us that a man’s word is more
important than his signature. And deeds are more important than any declaration.
Najib delivered on his promise. He called for national reconciliation during
his election result acceptance speech. Najib’s deeds matched his word.
4.
On
Election Day, do you feel that the agreement was still in place? Had anything
happened before Election Day to invalidate the agreement?
Hamid
Awaludin:
I am very sure that nothing jeopardized the agreement in the run
up to the election or on Election Day. The agreement still stood. Things
changed after Najib was declared the winner. Even the day after Najib’s
victory, I was personally optimistic that a deal is deal, and both sides would
abide by the deal. But Anwar broke the deal. Perhaps he was unable to manage
his followers, especially because the DAP had won more seats than Anwar’s own
party. Anwar found himself in a difficult position. But a leader must lead, not
be led.
5.
Do
you and Jusuf Kalla feel Anwar broke the deal? If so, how?
Hamid
Awaludin:
I feel that Anwar still does not accept political reality. Perhaps
he has things he will not say because he doesn’t want to hurt people. I don’t
know.
6.
Do
you feel Anwar was/is sincere in wanting national reconciliation in Malaysia?
Hamid
Awaludin:
I believed that Anwar had sincerity and I still hope he has.
7.
Why
do you think Anwar is behaving in the manner in which he is – denying the
agreement, refusing to cede defeat and organising protests across Malaysia?
Hamid
Awaludin:
From the beginning, Anwar convinced himself that he would win
the election. He had struggled for so long and he thought that this was the end
of the struggle. He thought he would win the battle and defeat Barisan Nasional.
His belief was strengthened by opinion polls that were often in his favour. And
each rally Anwar held during the campaign attracted massive crowds. But in the
end, the people’s choice is the ultimate factor in a democracy.
Anwar believed he would win the election but he was afraid Najib
would resist and not hand over power. So Anwar wanted insurance against this
scenario. That is why he came up with the idea of the deal.
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